Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Welcome to Insightful Questions, the podcast where we dive deep into the big ideas shaping Eastside Prep's community and beyond. I'm your host, Sam Uswak. Each episode, I'll be sitting down with different members of our EPS community.
Join us as we ask the insightful questions that help us lead with compassion and listen with intention. Let's get started.
Joining us today are two guests who play key roles in shaping the student athlete experience at Eastside Prep. First, we have Abby Miller, a senior who has been a dedicated athlete since arriving in ninth grade in 2021. As the athletics representative on the Student Leadership Council, Abby leads with passion and commitment. Throughout her high school career, she has competed in girls soccer, tennis, ultimate and basketball, and contributed in the Eagle Eye newspaper.
We're also joined by Kim Eng, who has been guiding EPS Sports as our Director of Athletics since 2018. Under her leadership, our sports programs have expanded significantly with the growing number of students participating, 21% increase in the last six years, and from 30 to 50 teams and teams competing at playoff, state, and even national levels.
But more than just competition, Kim has helped cultivate the Eagles school spirit, working alongside parent, guardian, boosters and student leaders to build a supportive and connected athletic community.
We're excited to hear from both Abby and Kim about the role of empathy in athletics and how it shapes the EPS experience.
Hey, Kim. Hey, Abby.
[00:01:52] Speaker B: Hello.
[00:01:53] Speaker C: How's it going?
[00:01:54] Speaker A: It's going great. Abby, I have to let you know that this is a momentous moment. You are the very first student guest. Thank you so much.
[00:02:02] Speaker B: I'm so honored. I hope I represent my peers well.
[00:02:06] Speaker A: I know you will. I know you will. And Kim, Hi.
[00:02:10] Speaker C: Hi, Sam. How are you doing?
[00:02:11] Speaker A: I'm doing great, Kim. Thank you. All right, let's get started. Kim, I'm going to start with you. How do you see compassionate leadership influencing the culture of athletics at eps?
[00:02:21] Speaker C: I'm going to steal a quote from one of my coaches. People must know that you care before they care what you know. It's really important that our students know that our coaches care about them as people, as students, more so than how fast they can run or how many points they can score. And it kind of sets the culture and the foundation that our coaches and our students care about each other's teammates. They tend to work harder and they show up every day and work for each other.
[00:02:50] Speaker A: You know what's amazing about that quote is the first time I ever heard. That was my very first day observing a class at Newport High in 1998, and it was the first thing that the classroom teacher said, she said, I'm going to tell you everything you need to know. Don't even go to grad school. And she said that.
She said what? She said it matters that the kids know we care. Oh, that's great. So to both of you, we want to field competitive teams. It is not a bad thing to want to win. Right? How do you balance the competitive nature of sports with the values of empathy and compassionate leadership?
[00:03:27] Speaker B: Being one of four children in my family and playing sports since before I could probably even walk, competition has been a huge factor of sports. But I also think that the best teams succeed when they balance drive with support leaders and teaching. Not only having captains and leaders, but how can we support everyone to have more compassionate dialogue and more empathy? And I also think that the more we create a safe space and the more dialogue we provide, the more that the team is bonded and the more competitive you can be out on the field or court.
[00:04:01] Speaker A: What do you think, Kim? That's going to be probably a tough act to follow.
[00:04:04] Speaker C: Yeah, I don't even want to try to follow that, actually. But I did want to use a prime example. Abby, do you care if I use you an example? So something that Abby reminded me is she just came off a girls basketball season. They had a really, really great season. But one of the games we were playing Bear Creek, and watching this game was a little bit tough as the Eagles kind of got down. I think it was 0:18, and we weren't on the scoreboard yet. You know, you typically see teams get down, give up, as evidenced by the Super Bowl. Right. We were on TV and watching, watching that happen with the Chiefs, but not like our girls. They just kept fighting, fighting and chipping away and chipping away. And here's where Abby comes in the last 30 seconds of the game. We were totally in this game and down by two, and it was like, unbelievable. So we're in this game, and then Abby took a shot, and it was a great shot. It didn't go in. And then something happened. You know, other things happened. Abby got another chance, and it didn't go in. And we ended up losing the game by two. And the coolest thing was I looked over at the coach and smile from ear to ear. And I went up to him, I said, hey, that tough loss. And I said, but what a great game. He said, no, no, no. He's like, did you see that? Abby was fearless. He's like, abby wanted to take the last shot. We wanted the ball in our hands, and it was so close. They were such good shots. And he was not at all bummed about this loss. It was so. He was just so excited about the fight in this team and that Abby wanted the ball at the end of the. At the end of the game. It was. It was just a really cool moment.
[00:05:28] Speaker A: That's amazing. You know, I was at the. And I think you were sick for this one, Abby, but I was at the EPS Busch playoff game at Bush School, and, you know, the team. Team was. It was pretty close early on, and then the. The score, you know, started to go in Bush's favor.
There was no quit there. There was not a second of no hustle, and there was no one pointing at each other and kind of bringing him down. Like, you're not doing this. You're not doing that now. You weren't there, but I suspect that that's a result of you leading that team and what you're trying to instill in your teammates.
[00:06:06] Speaker B: Yeah, I think, especially off the Bear Creek example, talking about empathy, I did take the last shot, and it didn't go in. I think that was hard on me. But I love that we prioritize empathy because we went back into that locker room and my teammates were able to recognize and say, here's what. I could have done better, too. I missed this shot, and they were there to pick me up, but then also to transition and also celebrate the win. They were a top team in our division, and just our resiliency and ability to come back, pick each other up as a team, I think was a huge bonding moment for us.
[00:06:35] Speaker A: Oh, that's great. That's amazing. Those comeback stories, even if you fall two points short, I mean, it's so. I would imagine it would be tempting or easy to just pack it in in the face of that challenge, but to just lean into it, like, with arms linked, is just so great to hear. So this one's for you, Abby. I'm curious. You know, you're the sports rep on our student Leadership Council. You do a lot of work to help promote Eagle spirit, to put on events for students to really, like, bring a lot of joy and a lot of energy to the student life side of things at school. But I would imagine as you're planning or as you're working with your peers, you know, it can get tough, it can get challenging. How do you foster empathy? How do you keep on track when things are starting to go off the rails, when you're planning or working on the council?
[00:07:27] Speaker B: I've learned a lot over the Course. And I think that being a leader on the field, in court also has different aspects than being able to be the sports rep on slc. And I think when I'm trying to lead so many different teams with so many different interests, I think that empathetic dialogue is the most important thing. And I think the number one thing I do been taught growing up is that the best solutions come from the most diverse set of perspectives. And I think across multitudes of sports and courts and the water and the field and the pitch, I think that we have a lot of opportunity to expand and grow. And so as a leader, I look to create spaces where people feel heard and they feel safe enough sharing their ideas and perspectives. So maybe it's turned down, but the next time they feel like they have the ability to come back and share their second idea, which may build on that and be even better. And so something. Even before I was on slc, I started the student Athletic Leadership Club with my sister, which we look to create a space where people are directly able to communicate. Me, I mean, I'm a peer. I'm someone who's looking to improve their experience too. And it doesn't just take one person. So whether it's calling an extra time out for a team huddle during a game or saying at the assembly, hey guys, on Friday I'm gonna be in this room. I want you to come and I wanna hear your experiences. I think that's how we get through challenging moments, and I think that's how we have kids coming back and be willing to share their ideas for the next challenge.
[00:08:50] Speaker A: Awesome. Thank you so much. So to both of you, I think sometimes when people hear the word dialogue, they really fixate on the talking part of it. But in a true dialogue, there's an awful lot of listening. So what role does listening play in resolving conflicts or misunderstandings within the team?
[00:09:09] Speaker C: That's a tough question too. It's funny because I think the athletics culture that we're trying to build here at Eastside Prep is very different from the one that I grew up playing. When I was an athlete, it was much more, suck it up, buttercup, you can do this or whatever. And if I was struggling, it was like, well, someone's right there to take your starting place, right? I think it's more been really eye opening and fun for me to kind of watch this transition and try to build a different culture here at east side Prep. Just an example that even happened this basketball season. We had a player on the boys team who skipped a practice and my instinct is to say, you skipped a practice, you shouldn't play in the game. Like, why are you skipping practices? You committed to the team. And I had to take a step back and think about, why did this kid miss this practice? So I kind of, you know, I went up to him and I just said, how you doing? Like, you know, you were gone yesterday. And he just said, missing. I just needed a day. And I'm like, yeah, I get that. I said, so, you know, if you want to talk about it, I'm here for you. And if you just need a day, thank you for letting us know that you needed a day. And kind of went on thinking, I don't have a clue what's going on with this kid right now, but I know that he loves basketball and that if he missed basketball, it was probably a really good reason why instead of jumping to the consequence, it was more about listening to the student about what was just kind of going on with them.
[00:10:29] Speaker B: I think for me, I love that point. I think too, as an athlete and a leader, I appreciate when the leaders above me are willing to take the time to listen because a lot of times the original thought wasn't the thought that was going through my mind. So being able to have that adult or someone who has a higher leadership role than me, who typically be in spaces outside of Epsilon, didn't ask what was going on first, has been super powerful. I think as a leader. I mentioned I'm one of four and I have two sisters and then we have a brother who's the youngest of the family and my two sisters, they both go to eps. One just graduated. So as you probably know, us three were really loud. We're go getters, we love doing anything, trying new things. And my little brother, he's quieter and reserved and a lot of people think he's different than the three of us. And so being able to watch him grow and sometimes when we have disagreements or we're navigating through conflict as a family, it's super interesting to give him some space. And even though he's more quiet sometimes his perspective or his solutions are a lot different routes than me or my sisters would have taken. And a lot of times can be the initial solutions that resolve the conflict. And so that's really shown me just the power in listening. And I think that again, everyone has such a different perspective on things. And so the more perspectives we hear and the more ideas for solutions, the farther we can get.
[00:11:48] Speaker A: I'm excited about asking this next question because it's Actually a little bit near and dear to me because when I reflect on my experience with athletics in high school, I think about the moments that taught me lessons that quite frankly still persist. And I think about how I was able to carry the lesson from, you know, either the football field or the wrestling mat to like the rest of my life. Have you seen your experiences in athletics influence how you approach other parts of your life? Whether it's academics or friendships or leadership roles? How does it translate, if you will?
[00:12:24] Speaker B: I like to say, as much as I love trophies and podiums, I.
I will admit I think I play sport for those buzzer beaters moments, even bad calls from refs, high fives, coming off the bench. Ben Ergy, like we like to call it on the basketball team, whether it's demanding coaches or coaches who are more encouraging, connecting different plays, even practices in the cold rain. Throughout the many years of sport I've played and the privilege I've had to play a wide range of sports, I think I see a lot of lessons in everything I do. I've learned a lot of perseverance and grit, which is something I think you need to be able to thrive at eps, we have a really rigorous community and I think that's pushed me to be an even better version of myself. But that was not through lack of late night studying or extra time in the mornings on the bus, getting my computer out and getting to work. I think it's grown me as a leader. I've been able to have a lot of sports experience. And so not only have I been able to be a leader for a diverse set of teammates who have different needs, some need more encouraging, others need more space to be able to thrive. But I've also been able to play under a wide range of coaches. And so I've been able to see a bunch of different leadership styles, what being more encouraging can do, what listening can do. And I think I take that into how I lead in not only athletics, but around school as well.
[00:13:47] Speaker A: To follow up on that, you know, you mentioned there, understanding your teammates and knowing how to meet them, where they are, that's something I do every day. I think about every day. You know, we're all different people.
When does someone need to be pushed? When does someone need to be picked up? When does it need to be quiet? When does it need to be in your face? You know what I mean?
Might be a default, I don't know.
[00:14:12] Speaker C: Well, and each athlete learns differently, right? So I remember when I was coaching a team, we had a tough loss and the next day at practice, I just kind of felt like the energy was down. So I was like, you know what? Okay, we don't need to practice hitting, serving. We can do that. Let's all sit. What are things that I can do? And I'm here just to listen, not to judge. And it was super interesting because the first person was like, when you yell at me or like, hey, try to motivate me to do something, your voice is loud and it kind of freaks me out. And then I cower a little bit. I'm like, oh, thanks, that's really good to know. Now I know how to best serve you. And then the next one was like, no, no, no, no. I need you to yell at me really loudly. Because if you don't, I don't think that you care, that you have confidence in me. I'm like, okay. So there were 12 different answers for 12 different ways. And it was like, you know, I think I said it before. If the coaches really get to know and care about their athletes, like Abby said, I like the buzzer beaters and the game winning shots as well. But that stuff will come. But it's the little baby steps along along the way.
[00:15:09] Speaker B: I think too, sports is so special because you get direct results at the end of the game, you loss or a tie. And so as a leader on the sports areas, I'm able to see, okay, this is what I tried last practice and this is how our team performed then. And so it's really taught me about different aspects of leadership and that being a leader isn't just making decisions or being the loudest voice. It's about listening. It's about understanding. It's about different perspectives. It's about creating an environment where everyone can be best motivated, encouraged, and best served. And being able to see the direct reflection of leadership after hours at practice is really inspiring and encouraging.
[00:15:47] Speaker A: Well, one of the things I've appreciated, Abby, you as a captain, you know, and a student leader, and Kim, you as an overall school leader here at Eastside Prep, is that. And I've heard you say this a couple times now, whether it's at a banquet or in front of the faculty and staff, is that, you know, the wins and the losses and the podiums and the trophies are all the results of what you're really trying to get. Camaraderie, that commitment. If all of those conditions are in place, the other stuff takes care of itself. And I think that's the right order of operations, if you will.
[00:16:19] Speaker C: Sure. I mean, and that's what we're trying to do here, when you think about education based athletics, it is not about the final score or outcome of the game. It's court or the field or the water. That's our classroom.
[00:16:31] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:16:31] Speaker C: So this is our classroom to teach different lifestyles, skills.
[00:16:34] Speaker B: Sometimes it can be hard to fail in an academic setting. And so having that ability to, after a long day, go out, let my stress out on the field and be able to not only fall down, get back up, but help a teammate up and help them go through that as well is super powerful.
[00:16:50] Speaker A: I think there's also something so special. You know, you help that teammate up and then you're in that huddle and you're facing adversity and the trust that gets built. And when you can look into the eyes of everyone and know it's kind of like a theater ensemble in the same way. I gotcha. So now I'm in the best position to just go for it in whatever the go for it is. Right. Whether it's the play, the performance, you know, the academic experience.
[00:17:18] Speaker C: Sure. When you know that your teammate's got your back, there's nothing more powerful.
[00:17:22] Speaker A: Nothing more powerful.
[00:17:23] Speaker B: You asked about how friendships have formed. The closest friends I've made are those through teams. At the end of the day, it's the same girls I'm walking off the field with, win or lose. And I think it's taught me to be able to trust my relationship outside. And the more I put risk and the more I put effort into developing those relationships, and the more trust I give, the better and closer those relationships will become.
[00:17:45] Speaker A: Absolutely.
[00:17:46] Speaker C: And Abby doesn't know this yet because she's still in high school, but now that I'm not gonna tell you my age, but when I think back about my high school sports experience, like at the time it was very much, did we make it to state? You know, when I think back now, I don't remember any of the actual games or the losses or the wins, all that happens. I remember the funny bus rides or the laughing with my friends, or the post team dinners or just us laughing at our coach because they said something silly or whatever it was. I remember the moments so much more than the outcome of the game. And that's when I look back. That's when I look back and smile.
[00:18:18] Speaker A: Well, we have come to the final question. So if y'all could share one message with the community about the role of empathy in athletics, what would it be?
[00:18:28] Speaker B: I think that empathy is a large part of my athletic experience. My dad likes to talk about this story. When I was 10 years old, we were in a finals of a soccer tournament in a penalty shootout, and we lost, and I came off the field in tears, and my dad was like, you're 10 years old. You just won a medal. Still, this is something to celebrate. But the ability to really feel and be accepted for that feeling is super important. And I think that empathy is such a large part of athletics because it transforms it from just being a game where you get a medal or you come off the field with a win into creating a community and really learning those life lessons.
[00:19:06] Speaker C: To Abby's point, you know, she said she was crying. And it's not just little ones who cry. I've seen plenty of seniors cry. From my standpoint, crying means you care.
[00:19:15] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:19:16] Speaker C: That's really cool, right? If an athlete is crying, it's not like, oh, my gosh, you shouldn't cry. There's no crying in sports. It's like, no, that means you care. So let's think about, like, take all that passion, all the energy and. And not worry about the outcome as much as, what did you learn along the way and what can you tweak or change for next time? Not so much outcome oriented, but just how we got there.
[00:19:37] Speaker B: I think, too, when we have people who prioritize, empathetic players, empathetic coaches, empathetic teams, it creates a space where respect, connection, and shared passion kind of matter just as much as the score. And for me, it's not just like the medals and the scoreboard at the end of the game that has brought me back to sports every season. It's the teams and it's the bonds I form and the people I get to meet.
[00:19:58] Speaker A: Oh, my goodness. Abby, Kim, I cannot thank you enough for taking some time to talk about your experiences. And, Abby, thank you so much for the leadership you're providing, both through sports, but also for the student body in general. And same to you, Kim, leading this incredible program and leading with empathy. So thanks, y'all.
[00:20:17] Speaker B: Yeah. Thank you so much. And as I enter my 12th season sports EPS, I ask you to show up to a spring season game.
[00:20:23] Speaker A: Yes. Yes. Their challenge accepted. Come on, Eagle Nation. Get on out to the fields this spring. All right, well, for more insights, be sure to check out the EPS weekly news every Friday.
